Biggest gripe with XTM Téma indítója: Samuel Murray
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Samuel Murray 
Hollandia
Local time: 13:59
Tag (2006 óta)
angol - afrikaans
+ ...
Hello XTM people
My biggest gripe with XTM are those leading and trailing tags, and the fact that there is not a thing I can do about it. Every tag must be inserted manually (unless you copy a source or a fuzzy match, but still then you have to carefully work "between" tags).
Here's a classic example of what I'm talking about:
90% of the segm... See more Hello XTM people
My biggest gripe with XTM are those leading and trailing tags, and the fact that there is not a thing I can do about it. Every tag must be inserted manually (unless you copy a source or a fuzzy match, but still then you have to carefully work "between" tags).
Here's a classic example of what I'm talking about:
90% of the segments in my file have these leading and trailing tags, and they serve absolutely no purpose other than to make the translator work longer hours. XTM offers no feature to hide them or to auto-insert them afterwards. These green tags often occur in short segments, so the more short segments you have, the more green tags you have, and the exponentially more expensive the translation becomes for the translator.
I find it unfortunate that you can't export a file in XTM, translate it in a fast CAT tool, and then upload it again. You can export a preview in several versions, though none of them contain the tags.
Samuel ▲ Collapse
| | | | LEXpert
Egyesült Államok
Local time: 06:59
Tag (2008 óta)
horvát - angol
+ ...
| XTM Intl
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 12:59
Dear Samuel,
Green inline elements reflect source text font properties such as bold, italics, underline, hyperlinks, font change and more. They are key to perform the proper reintegration of the target files after translation, so they always have to be placed in the target text.
XTM Cloud also provides options for offline translation, including working in other CAT tools, and you can find all necessary information about it, inline elements, and other aspects of XTM Clou... See more Dear Samuel,
Green inline elements reflect source text font properties such as bold, italics, underline, hyperlinks, font change and more. They are key to perform the proper reintegration of the target files after translation, so they always have to be placed in the target text.
XTM Cloud also provides options for offline translation, including working in other CAT tools, and you can find all necessary information about it, inline elements, and other aspects of XTM Cloud in the XTM Manual that is available on the Configuration tab, Help and information or you can download it from the resource section of our website: http://xtm-intl.com/resources/documentation.
XTM Cloud is there to accelerate and ease your work. The inline elements help you deliver a complete translation that complies with your client’s technical requirements, and therefore build your quality oriented image.
Whenever you find the number of inline elements disturbing, first contact your client to verify this. If it does not solve your problems contact XTM Support, and we will check your configuration to find the cause.
Should you have more questions please contact our support at support@xtm-intl.com.
Your sincerely,
XTM Support ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Ditto - horrible | Apr 12, 2016 |
I did one project in XTM-cloud once; took me 3x longer what it would have taken me normally - thankfully a short project (budgeted 30 minutes, it took me 90 to complete it because of the horrible format). Never again. I informed the PM that I would need to charge anything on XTM hourly going forward because of loss of productivity. My guess is that I wasn't the only translator who complained; I get loads of work from that client and never saw another XTM project again.
Another agenc... See more I did one project in XTM-cloud once; took me 3x longer what it would have taken me normally - thankfully a short project (budgeted 30 minutes, it took me 90 to complete it because of the horrible format). Never again. I informed the PM that I would need to charge anything on XTM hourly going forward because of loss of productivity. My guess is that I wasn't the only translator who complained; I get loads of work from that client and never saw another XTM project again.
Another agency I work with is trying out a different online/cloud CAT tool - not as bad, but completely insufficient - no personal TMs, no personal glossaries, no auto-suggest dictionaries, no 3rd party grammar tool supported - I explained to the PMs & to the person in charge of the migration why I couldn't work that way - not only did it take longer, but quality suffered and I couldn't risk my professional reputation. Glad to say, I still work with them, on my terms.
If there's one thing I hope creators of new/online/cloud CAT tools take away from this discussion it's that changing tools is not just changing tools, it's losing a decade or more of glossaries, autosuggest dictionaries that are fine-tuned not only to my vocabulary, but to my turns of phrase, as well as secondary master TMs. If I can't just load everything up & hit the ground running, I'm not interested. If I have to manually insert tags .EVER. .ANYWHERE. I'm not interested.
I find the answer from XTM particularly disingenuous - the tags are there because your software doesn't even support basics such as bold font - they're not there to 'accelerate and ease your work' or 'help you deliver a complete translation' - they're there because your software doesn't do the basics, let alone support the tools that professionals need - it's for dilettantes - it's on par with Tag Editor which is over a decade old.
Many agencies are being snookered because freelancer accounts are often free of charge so they think the migration is a zero-cost operation for the translator, but in reality it has an enormous cost. Losing half my business would financially hit me less that losing 2/3 of my productivity. ▲ Collapse
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XTM Intl
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 12:59
| Inline elements | Apr 13, 2016 |
Dear Arianne,
Thank you for expressing your concerns.
I am sorry to hear your first translation in XTM Cloud took more time than expected. The fact is, whenever you switch software, and have worked long enough with the old one, it takes a moment to get yourself used to the new one again. Recall when you moved from Windows 7 to Windows 8. The job you received was very small, and it did not even give you the chance to scratch the surface of what XTM Cloud has to offer. It... See more Dear Arianne,
Thank you for expressing your concerns.
I am sorry to hear your first translation in XTM Cloud took more time than expected. The fact is, whenever you switch software, and have worked long enough with the old one, it takes a moment to get yourself used to the new one again. Recall when you moved from Windows 7 to Windows 8. The job you received was very small, and it did not even give you the chance to scratch the surface of what XTM Cloud has to offer. It is also important to know that translator’s options in XTM Cloud depend in part on what the Administrator or Project Manager deem necessary and have configured for the user and for the project (in the Freelance version of XTM Cloud you do it yourself).
It is true that XTM Cloud holds bold in tags but it does not affect translation productivity. When you type in Word, and want to make an element bold you press Ctrl + B, start typing the text in bold, and press Ctrl + B again to finish typing in bold. In XTM Cloud, when you have tags that represent bold, you press Alt + the number displayed in the tag (for example Alt + 1), start typing the text between the bold tags, and press Alt + 1 again to finish typing between bold tags. It takes exactly same much time and same many key presses as if you were writing it in Word.
You can make it even more convenient by choosing the option to Populate target with source. Then you do not have to insert tags at all because they are already in the translation input field.
Your sincerely,
XTM Support ▲ Collapse
| | | | Samuel Murray
Hollandia
Local time: 13:59
Tag (2006 óta)
angol - afrikaans
+ ...
TÉMAINDÍTÓ | @XTM Support | Apr 13, 2016 |
XTM Intl wrote:
Green inline elements reflect source text font properties such as bold, italics, underline, hyperlinks, font change and more. They are key to perform the proper reintegration of the target files after translation, so they always have to be placed in the target text.
I understand that, but if an entire segment is e.g. bold, then it's not necessary to show the tags to the translator. It is highly unlikely that a translator would decide that a segment that is wholly bold in the source text should be partially bold in the target text.
XTM Cloud also provides options for offline translation...
Not all XTM installations have this option. Some do, and in those that do, I make use of it.
If it does not solve your problems, contact XTM Support, and we will check your configuration to find the cause.
Thanks, but I'm not free to contact XTM Support myself with regard to an XTM installation of a client of mine. I suppose this is a general gripe with online tools -- the translator can't do much about it if the client had set up the system incorrectly or with the least useful options, and calls to the support desk of the software must be limited to questions about how certain features work.
| | | | | The disconnect seems to be in the translation process | Apr 13, 2016 |
XTM Intl wrote:
When you type in Word, and want to make an element bold you press Ctrl + B, start typing the text in bold, and press Ctrl + B again to finish typing in bold.
I can't speak for others, but I don't do that - it would break my train of thought and the flow of my sentence to have to step back from what I'm writing to fiddle with formatting - I take care of formatting at the review step, once my translation has gelled into its final form.
| | | | Samuel Murray
Hollandia
Local time: 13:59
Tag (2006 óta)
angol - afrikaans
+ ...
TÉMAINDÍTÓ | What I do... | Apr 13, 2016 |
Arianne Farah wrote:
XTM Intl wrote:
When you type in Word, and want to make an element bold you press Ctrl + B, start typing the text in bold, and press Ctrl + B again to finish typing in bold.
I can't speak for others, but I don't do that... I take care of formatting at the review step, once my translation has gelled into its final form.
FWIW: I do make text bold during the writing step, although I usually type first, and then I mark the words that I want to make bold, and press Ctrl+B. But XTM doesn't have "bold" -- it only has tags. In CAT tools that allow me to insert tags without looking at the keyboard (e.g. WFC), I insert tags during the typing step itself. In CAT tools like XTM, where I can only insert tags while looking at the keyboard, I insert the tags after having typed the text of a segment.
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XTM Intl
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 12:59
Dear Samuel,
You are right. If an entire segment is bold, software should not show these tags to the translator, and by default XTM Cloud does not do that.
There is an option that enables showing all tags but it requires the client to send a specific request to XTM Support to do this. It is not even available in the user interface o... See more Dear Samuel,
You are right. If an entire segment is bold, software should not show these tags to the translator, and by default XTM Cloud does not do that.
There is an option that enables showing all tags but it requires the client to send a specific request to XTM Support to do this. It is not even available in the user interface on your client’s side (on purpose, in order not to make more work for you inserting them unless there is a good reason).
We can only verify what is the certain cause of the problem you have described if you contact XTM Support with the detailed account information. Do not hesitate.
Dear Samuel & Arianne
It is highly appreciated that you explained your translation process with tags. Both of you work different, and other translators have own ways too. It is always difficult to satisfy everyone but XTM International will take your valuable feedback into account to improve tag handling with new methods.
Yours sincerely,
XTM Support ▲ Collapse
| | | | Vickie Dimitriadou (X)
Local time: 14:59
angol - görög
| Tags not included in the exported files | Sep 12, 2020 |
Samuel Murray wrote:
You can export a preview in several versions, though none of them contain the tags.
Can't the developers make it possible for the tags to be included and shown in the exported files?
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