https://hun.proz.com/forum/medical/325835-should_unqualified_translators_be_permitted_to_translate_medical_healthcare_documents-page2.html

A témához tartozó oldalak:   < [1 2 3 4] >
Should unqualified translators be permitted to translate medical/healthcare documents?
Téma indítója: Cathy McCormick

Sujan Azad Parikh
India
Local time: 12:12
német - angol
+ ...
Not at all Jun 5, 2018

No I don't think so that would be a good idea because since its related to medical/healthcare documents, even the slightest of mistakes can create a life or death situation. So, I would say only certified translators be used for this purpose - Sujan Azad Parikh.

 

Morano El-Kholy  Identity Verified
Egyiptom
Local time: 08:42
Tag (2011 óta)
angol - arab
+ ...
Yes, I do... Jun 5, 2018

Yes, I think that translators with good experience can be permitted to translate medical/healthcare documents. Otherwise, lawsuit cases will be only translated by the lawyers! Novels/Dramas will be only translated by the novelists and writers! Scientific researches will be only translated by the scientists!

Then, what remained for the translator to work in? He simply will retire or search for another career.


 

Rebecca Davis  Identity Verified
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 06:42
francia - angol
+ ...
No, they should not Jun 5, 2018

Have been translating for 10 years in a pretty wide variety of fields, although mostly finance and (finance-related) law, as I have career experience of both. Have been offered medical translations on a number of occasions and have always turned them down outright, because no matter how good my linguistic skills are, I do not have the required background, and a mistake that is not picked up could actually harm someone.

 

Tom in London
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 06:42
Tag (2008 óta)
olasz - angol
My opinion Jun 5, 2018

My personal view of this:

Put yourself in the position of the end user. Imagine that you are NOT a translator and you don't speak any languages other than your own. Here are two possible scenarios:

1.

You have had hospital treatment in a foreign country for a serious illness and have been prescribed ongoing medication. You have now returned to your own country. Your local doctors want to know what happened to you, how it was treated, and what medication yo
... See more
My personal view of this:

Put yourself in the position of the end user. Imagine that you are NOT a translator and you don't speak any languages other than your own. Here are two possible scenarios:

1.

You have had hospital treatment in a foreign country for a serious illness and have been prescribed ongoing medication. You have now returned to your own country. Your local doctors want to know what happened to you, how it was treated, and what medication you were prescribed. You need all of your foreign medical records to be translated. Would you like the translator to have medical expertise in both languages and both countries, or would you not care?

2.

You have been accused of calumny in a foreign country and have been arrested by the local police, questioned at the police station, released on bail, taken to court, sentenced to the payment of a very large fine, and released with the conviction placed on your criminal record in that country. You appealed, and your appeal was upheld but the history of the conviction remains on your record.

You are now applying for a job in your own country and are required to provide full documentation about this conviction, including what you were charged with at the police station, details of how the court case was conducted, the appeal, and your criminal record.

Would you like the translator to have legal expertise in both languages and both jurisdictions, or would you not care?
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Christine Andersen  Identity Verified
Dánia
Local time: 07:42
Tag (2003 óta)
dán - angol
+ ...
I would want a qualified translator Jun 5, 2018

Please define 'unqualified'! The short answer is no, of course not!
What we are really discussing is WHICH qualifications are indispensable, and perhaps how to assess experience in real life, when you can't always find anyone with all the ideal qualifications anyway.

In both Tom's scenarios, I would want someone who was qualified to TRANSLATE and/or interpret, with a sufficient knowledge of the medical and legal issues in both countries, as appropriate.

In scenari
... See more
Please define 'unqualified'! The short answer is no, of course not!
What we are really discussing is WHICH qualifications are indispensable, and perhaps how to assess experience in real life, when you can't always find anyone with all the ideal qualifications anyway.

In both Tom's scenarios, I would want someone who was qualified to TRANSLATE and/or interpret, with a sufficient knowledge of the medical and legal issues in both countries, as appropriate.

In scenario 1, I would not care whether that person was actually qualified to treat me and prescribe medication, provided he/she could refer doctors in my home country to the appropriate information about the medication (a lot of it is standardised in the EU) and explain what had happened.

If a doctor from abroad could explain everything in Danish to my local GP, then fine and good, but I would trust several of my translator colleagues who are not actually qualified to practise medicine, while many doctors would not be able to do the job. All due respect to Rebecca Davis and others who know they are not qualified. I turn down a lot of financial and technical jobs (and others) because I am not qualified. That does not mean that no other translator is qualified either.

In scenario 2, I know there are many translators who also have legal qualifications. Not all of them are actually qualified to set up in business and practise as attorneys, solicitors, barristers, whatever they are called in their country. Certainly, a lot of translators might be out of their depth, but I know at least a couple who have a sufficient background knowledge of international law and could read up on the details as a legal expert would.

I am not sure all Danish lawyers could cope with the foreign law. They would not be able to read it to check details. I would want someone qualified in both languages as well as both legal systems to do the translations.
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Tom in London
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 06:42
Tag (2008 óta)
olasz - angol
Specification Jun 5, 2018

Christine Andersen wrote:

....provided he/she could refer doctors in my home country to the appropriate information about the medication (a lot of it is standardised in the EU) and explain what had happened.


Sorry, I forgot to specify. The country is Uzbekistan.


 

Christine Andersen  Identity Verified
Dánia
Local time: 07:42
Tag (2003 óta)
dán - angol
+ ...
Well then I would probably want a translator... Jun 5, 2018

Tom in London wrote:

Christine Andersen wrote:

....provided he/she could refer doctors in my home country to the appropriate information about the medication (a lot of it is standardised in the EU) and explain what had happened.


Sorry, I forgot to specify. The country is Uzbekistan.


I don't know how many medics from Uzbekistan could cope with Danish, or how many Danish medics could cope with Uzbek… but in this case they might be able to get some help in English from the Danish Medicines Agency.
https://laegemiddelstyrelsen.dk/en/

Either way, you would need someone who could cope with the languages, all three if you had to go through an intermediate language…
There are immigrant doctors in the Danish health services. You might be able to find one from Uzbekistan who could help out. I would look for a qualified interpreter as well to increase my chances of finding someone!


 

Katalin Szilárd  Identity Verified
Magyarország
Local time: 07:42
angol - magyar
+ ...
End clients need to be educated Jun 5, 2018

Tom in London wrote:

My personal view of this:

Put yourself in the position of the end user. Imagine that you are NOT a translator and you don't speak any languages other than your own. Here are two possible scenarios:

1.

You have had hospital treatment in a foreign country for a serious illness and have been prescribed ongoing medication. You have now returned to your own country. Your local doctors want to know what happened to you, how it was treated, and what medication you were prescribed. You need all of your foreign medical records to be translated. Would you like the translator to have medical expertise in both languages and both countries, or would you not care?

2.

You have been accused of calumny in a foreign country and have been arrested by the local police, questioned at the police station, released on bail, taken to court, sentenced to the payment of a very large fine, and released with the conviction placed on your criminal record in that country. You appealed, and your appeal was upheld but the history of the conviction remains on your record.

You are now applying for a job in your own country and are required to provide full documentation about this conviction, including what you were charged with at the police station, details of how the court case was conducted, the appeal, and your criminal record.

Would you like the translator to have legal expertise in both languages and both jurisdictions, or would you not care?


In case 1) I wouldn't care whether the person who translates my medical documents has a physician or nurse diploma, I would care whether he/she is among the best medical translators.

In case 2) the same: I wouldn't care whether the person who translates my legal documents is a lawyer or not. I need his/her translation skills + her/his legal translation experience.

I saw too many times that a person who has a diploma in a certain field or who worked in a certain field cannot utilize this "benefit" because he/she is not able to translate well and accurately. Maybe she/he was a good expert in practice but translation is about being a linguist + being expertise in the field you are translating.
An end client doesn't know that, we have to educate them and the best is if he/she asks for a paid translation.


 

Tom in London
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 06:42
Tag (2008 óta)
olasz - angol
The end Jun 5, 2018

Katalin Szilárd wrote:
....we have to educate them and the best is if he/she asks for a paid translation.



In my example, the end client is you. Having to get medical treatment, or get legal clearance for a job, is no time for lectures on the refinements of translation.


 

Christine Andersen  Identity Verified
Dánia
Local time: 07:42
Tag (2003 óta)
dán - angol
+ ...
Another reason to choose a linguist Jun 5, 2018

Tom in London wrote:

Katalin Szilárd wrote:
....we have to educate them and the best is if he/she asks for a paid translation.



In my example, the end client is you. Having to get medical treatment, or get legal clearance for a job, is no time for lectures on the refinements of translation.


There are real-life complaints about supposedly bilingual doctors in the health services. They may be experts as doctors, but patients do not understand them, and feel they are not understood by the doctors. Either Danes do not understand immigrant doctors (and in any other country probably the natives say the same), or immigrant patients do not understand Danish/native doctors.

In the legal scenario you may have more time (i.e. it is not life-and-death) to explain and clarify, but in either situation, you need a competent linguist.

Academic titles and the Hippocratic Oath are not magical means to wisdom and knowledge. They follow on from years of study and training. Specific qualifications are required to practise medicine or law, but the same ones are not needed for translation.

If a doctor can do it, so can a translator. I would certainly want my translator/interpreter to be qualified, but precisely which certificates the person holds are less important.


 

Tom in London
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 06:42
Tag (2008 óta)
olasz - angol
This morning Jun 5, 2018

Christine Andersen wrote:

If a doctor can do it, so can a translator.



As it happens I saw my doctor this morning about a minor ailment. I should have told him this news !


 

Katalin Szilárd  Identity Verified
Magyarország
Local time: 07:42
angol - magyar
+ ...
We know it - the end client's education is a continous process Jun 5, 2018

Tom in London wrote:

Katalin Szilárd wrote:
....we have to educate them and the best is if he/she asks for a paid translation.



In my example, the end client is you. Having to get medical treatment, or get legal clearance for a job, is no time for lectures on the refinements of translation.


Yes, the end client is me. Since I'm a translator, I know who I need to look for. Based on my experience.
If I need legal advice I go to a lawyer, if I have medical problems I go to a physician and if I need my specialized documents to be translated I look for a specialized translator.
What I meant as "we need to educate end clients" is a continuous process on our side.

In legal translation even if you know both countries legal systems, you really need a very strong linguistic skill sometimes, because for example Hungarian and US or UK legal systems are very different, and if you don't have a linguistic skill, the result will be extremely long complex unintelligible sentences and you will be the only one who understands it. That's why you need that special linguistic skill: not to explain the difference between the 2 systems, but to find a new term (if it doesn't exist), and implement it into your sentence.

A very good specialized translation: when a person who works in that field and who is a native-speaker in the target language reads someone's translation and doesn't know that what she/he was reading was a translation and of course proofreaders also need to verify that the target text is the accurate translation of the source text.


 

Tom in London
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 06:42
Tag (2008 óta)
olasz - angol
YEs but Jun 5, 2018

YEs but I said "Imagine that you are NOT a translator and you don't speak any languages other than your own."

[Edited at 2018-06-05 13:16 GMT]


 

Katalin Szilárd  Identity Verified
Magyarország
Local time: 07:42
angol - magyar
+ ...
"Try walking in my shoes" Jun 5, 2018

Tom in London wrote:

YEs but I said "Imagine that you are NOT a translator "


This would be still true:

If I need legal advice I go to a lawyer, if I have medical problems I go to a physician and if I need my specialized documents to be translated I look for a specialized translator.

Maybe I would try to educate myself (find information on the net) or look for more information from translators I know.


 

Cathy McCormick  Identity Verified
Egyesült Királyság
Local time: 06:42
német - angol
+ ...
TÉMAINDÍTÓ
Good point but not many people give "newbie" translators a chance Jun 6, 2018

Kay Denney wrote:

Cathy McCormick wrote:

Do any of you think it really important that translators have some sort of a relevant degree or is experience all that matters?


If they cannot start translating medical documents, however will they gain experience?


This is something that I have been battling for a while now and something I frequently come across. It is difficult for new translators to gain any experience in their desired field nowadays. How is a translator able to gain experience if they aren't provided a chance to do the work in the first place? It's not unusual for companies to ask that a translator have 5 years or more of experience when it comes to medical translations, but how do you gain such experience if the bar is set so high? Translators who are only just starting out in their freelance career struggle to gain the experience they need. Having a degree is all well and good (I should know) but overall I think it's experience that matters most. New translators should be given a chance to prove themselves in their desired field.

As a PM, I used to outsource systematically to people with some kind of medical training. The translation was then proofread by a translator, who would then polish up the style while preserving the terminology.


Does that not mean then that there is more work for the proofreader? A doctor may indeed know the terminology but would not necessarily understand the makeup of a translation.


 
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