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Rates per hour for MTPE
Téma indítója: F Bossard

Claudio Porcellana  Identity Verified
Olaszország
Local time: 20:53
Tag (2004 óta)
angol - olasz
+ ...
Rates per hour for MTPE Aug 23, 2019

I recently experienced something quite the contrary. A few pieces of human translations I edited took much more time than I'd have spent on editing machine translations.


it is sad to see, but devilishly real!
and I can add that the quality of source sentences I normally see is steadily decreasing


[Edited at 2019-08-23 21:43 GMT]


mughwI
P.L.F. Persio
 

Bernhard Sulzer  Identity Verified
Egyesült Államok
Local time: 14:53
angol - német
+ ...
What we charge for Aug 24, 2019

Claudio Porcellana wrote:

I recently experienced something quite the contrary. A few pieces of human translations I edited took much more time than I'd have spent on editing machine translations.


it is sad to see, but devilishly real!
and I can add that the quality of source sentences I normally see is steadily decreasing


[Edited at 2019-08-23 21:43 GMT]


It almost seems as if some people need to constantly tout how great MT is. When they do that, they don't seem to realize that they don't do the profession any favors. Why?
I would invite everyone to read through previous forum posts. And ... whatever a machine translates MUST be checked by a human. And the knowledge the human translator brings to the table is what he is selling. And that's what we charge for.

If a human translator performed awfully then that is no proof of how good MT is. Think about it.
Let's just be a little more careful with what we say about MT. Much obliged.

[Edited at 2019-08-24 21:57 GMT]


Daryo
Thayenga
Marilena Berca
Milton Guo
Jan Truper
Claudio Porcellana
Theunis du Toit
 

Beatrice Schlegel, B.A.(hons.), M.A, MCIL
Local time: 19:53
Tag (2019 óta)
német - angol
+ ...
Taus post-editors directory Oct 1, 2020

[quote]Jean Dimitriadis wrote:

- TAUS post-editors directory only lists per hour rate - https://taus.net/post-editors TAUS also offers a post-editing course. Of course, with a per-hour rate, you cannot justify training your skills from the ground up at the expense of the client. See point below.


Dear Jean,

sorry, I know I'm a few years late, which is the reason I suspect that the TAUS post-editors directory is no longer available under this link. Can you remember how much they quoted for the per hour MTPE at all?

thanks so much,best regards
B


 

silviantonia  Identity Verified
Egyesült Államok
Local time: 11:53
ProZ.com-tag
angol - spanyol
+ ...
MT is generally nonsensical, and we are digging our own grave Nov 20, 2020

A group to which I belong bought expensive translation software, and have asked me as a group member to "look over" documents that they have created with their expensive piece of garbage. In general these are English to Spanish translations, and in the future they may include English to French.

The MT translations, despite the fact that they paid a fair sum of money for their "engine," are nonsensical. In one sentence, the "machine" uses male and female articles, adjectives, etc.
... See more
A group to which I belong bought expensive translation software, and have asked me as a group member to "look over" documents that they have created with their expensive piece of garbage. In general these are English to Spanish translations, and in the future they may include English to French.

The MT translations, despite the fact that they paid a fair sum of money for their "engine," are nonsensical. In one sentence, the "machine" uses male and female articles, adjectives, etc. without discrimination. Frequently lines are left untranslated, and more so if the term in English, for example, is in caps...

I was sent a translation to review on fencing (the sport, rather than the construction term). I didn't realize in the beginning why so much of the translation made NO SENSE. I finally realized that the program in some places was talking about the size and material used to replace fencing, and in others it was talking about the sport of fencing (esgrima, escrime). When I realized what the program had done, I spent some time laughing out loud... Ultimately, I charged the client for time spent "correcting" the mistakes, in addition to the words used... And I said, and I repeat that here, it would have been cheaper for you had you given me the document to translate in the first place.

The other atrocious thing that is happening with "automatic correction" on computers is that the spelling of words are changed. The computer or automatic correction rarely knows the difference between there, their, they're. And that is just one example.
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Susanta Chakraborty
India
Local time: 00:23
angol - bengáli
+ ...
Neat and clean answer Nov 23, 2020

To the point answer. Ty

Thayenga wrote:

Just quote your regular hourly rate. After all, it doesn't matter what you are working on, an hour of your time is an hours of your time, and needs to be paid accordingly.


Jorge Payan
 

Claudio Porcellana  Identity Verified
Olaszország
Local time: 20:53
Tag (2004 óta)
angol - olasz
+ ...
Rates per hour for MTPE Dec 2, 2020

I was referring to the quality of the source files, i.e. nothing to do with translators...


I really meant to say that the quality of manuals, IFUs, etc. is constantly decreasing
I hope you get my point, Bernhard Sulzer

Bernhard Sulzer wrote:
It almost seems as if some people need to constantly tout how great MT is. When they do that, they don't seem to realize that they don't do the profession any favors. Why?
I would invite everyone to read through previous forum posts. And ... whatever a machine translates MUST be checked by a human. And the knowledge the human translator brings to the table is what he is selling. And that's what we charge for.

If a human translator performed awfully then that is no proof of how good MT is. Think about it.
Let's just be a little more careful with what we say about MT. Much obliged.

[Edited at 2019-08-24 21:57 GMT]


[Edited at 2020-12-02 22:53 GMT]


 

Beth Jones  Identity Verified
Ausztria
Local time: 20:53
német - angol
Relieved I'm "no longer alone" in warning about MT's impact on a once-respected profession Dec 15, 2020

Running across this discussion long (!) after the fact, I still feel compelled to agree with many of the comments here. I am also very relieved to finally note that others in this once-respected, intellectual, bi-lingual writers' profession are also up in arms over our younger / less insightful colleagues' blithe acceptance of the dumbed-down, CAT tool and machine translation trend.

I did not work at reseaching and compiling thousands of pages of detailed technical and business glo
... See more
Running across this discussion long (!) after the fact, I still feel compelled to agree with many of the comments here. I am also very relieved to finally note that others in this once-respected, intellectual, bi-lingual writers' profession are also up in arms over our younger / less insightful colleagues' blithe acceptance of the dumbed-down, CAT tool and machine translation trend.

I did not work at reseaching and compiling thousands of pages of detailed technical and business glossaries for hundreds of diverse clients in dozens of fields over 30-plus years to be demoted to being an editor for Google Translate's GIBBERISH for a pittance, just because some agency decides to kowtow to a clueless corporate client.

But then, many of my clients had to learn to respect how translators WORK -- that we DON'T just push a button somewhere and deliver 20K words over the weekend, nor do we passively accept what a grade-school dictionary (or search engine) spits out.

I've had to repeat my motto many times over the years: “There are super-fast translations and there are good translations. Which kind do you want?"

Translators research terminology and localization and deliver not just a 1:1 match-up of words, we transform the nuanced message of one language into another.

And no translator/proofreader worth their salt will meekly accept just any deadline for any price.
But that is precisely what many agencies (and even some translators) are demanding by cheerleading for MT and thereby misrepresenting and demeaning our profession -- while driving prices into the cellar.

I also agree that the automation of tasks (without the benefit of human intelligence/knowledge of nuance) leads to lower quality translations. I’ve encountered multiple, serious errors when proofreading technical & scientific translations that were produced by the (otherwise excellent) translator innocently running a SpellCheck right before submission.

In short, I feel so sorry for my younger colleagues, who I've sadly noted have little to no idea about the existence of the intellectual, well-paid profession I've just described here.

And as for the writing "skills" their current MT activities foster... SIGH.
Fuggeddaboutit.
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writeaway
Chris T
 

Chris T  Identity Verified
Egyesült Királyság
svéd - angol
+ ...
A+ Dec 16, 2020

Beth Jones wrote:
A quality rant

But I fear the horse is out of the bag and the cat has bolted.

If I could turn back time...

And yes, I am wearing an identical outfit as I type. I always do when working. And shopping. It’s important to put comfort first.


P.L.F. Persio
 

Claudio Porcellana  Identity Verified
Olaszország
Local time: 20:53
Tag (2004 óta)
angol - olasz
+ ...
Rates per hour for MTPE May 1

And while peers rant, as usual when some process improvement jumps out, PEMT goes on its own way

Currently, are LPs that take matters into theirs own hands, for example
https://www.proz.com/job/1791778

But it's just a matter of time (a little time) that most SMBs (large companies started a dozen of years ago) will start using an internal MT, then asking LPs to do the rest<
... See more
And while peers rant, as usual when some process improvement jumps out, PEMT goes on its own way

Currently, are LPs that take matters into theirs own hands, for example
https://www.proz.com/job/1791778

But it's just a matter of time (a little time) that most SMBs (large companies started a dozen of years ago) will start using an internal MT, then asking LPs to do the rest

Take care

P.S. I did PEMT audits for a very big LP, but I never did PEMT jobs; nevertheless I am prepared doing it if necessary in the future

P.S. 2: the rant about "the automation of tasks (without the benefit of human intelligence/knowledge of nuance)" is out of place because PEMT involves humans

[Edited at 2021-05-01 10:22 GMT]
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P.L.F. Persio
Jorge Payan
 

jyuan_us  Identity Verified
Egyesült Államok
Local time: 14:53
Tag (2005 óta)
angol - kínai
+ ...
An hour‘s worth May 3

Thayenga wrote:

Just quote your regular hourly rate. After all, it doesn't matter what you are working on, an hour of your time is an hours of your time, and needs to be paid accordingly.


An hour spent in task A might be worth very differently to an hour spent in task B. To me, one should charge a higher hourly rate for MTPE than for translating. One hour spent in translation may bring about a great sense of accomplishment, and you are happy with that. However, after fixing MT garbage for one hour, you feel tired and you could have a sense of spending a valuable hour of your time on something that is upsetting.

[Edited at 2021-05-03 17:38 GMT]


Kuochoe Nikoi-Kotei
 
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